DDeep Dive with Ali Abdaal
← All episodes
Carrie Rose (Rise at Seven)30 March 2023

How To Build A Million Dollar Marketing Agency In 1 Year - Carrie Rose (Rise at Seven)

5Frameworks
15Insights

Frameworks in this episode

Insights & moments

The myth-busts, hot takes, explainers, and tools worth keeping.

Myth Buster· 1

Myth Buster36:00

PR isn't about relationships — journalists need traffic and shares

Carrie pushes back on the traditional PR belief that press coverage comes from building journalist relationships. Her position is that if the story is weak, no relationship saves it — even celebrity fashion collaborations get ignored. Journalists have their own KPIs: traffic and social shares. So the question a PR should answer isn't 'do I know this editor?' but 'can they build a piece from this that their readers will click and share?'

a lot of traditional PRs might say, um, you need to build relationships and that's how you're going to get the press coverage for your…

Carrie Rose · 36:00

No one really cares that, you know, Khloe Kardashian has done another range with another fashion brand.

Carrie Rose · 36:30

Hot Take· 2

Hot Take1:28:00

Her controversial read on the pay gap: who asks for the money

Carrie offers a behavioural explanation she flags as potentially unpopular. She acknowledges the gender pay gap data exists, but says what she observes is that men are more likely to ask for a pay rise because they're more confident asking for money, while women more often agree to do extra work for free out of what she calls a maternal instinct. Her practical response as a leader is disclosure: tell women explicitly that the man in the same position would have asked for another fifty quid, so they can recalibrate.

And men are more likely to ask for a pay rise because they're more confident to ask for more money.

Carrie Rose · 1:28:00

So, they're often open to doing things for free because it's a maternal instinct.

Carrie Rose · 1:28:00
Hot Take1:33:30

Money is easier to make than people think — the hard part is the business

Rise at Seven set a first-year KPI of £300k revenue, hit it in about three months, and finished the year at £1.5 million after Carrie had promised a team holiday at a million she didn't expect to reach. Year two to three took the business from £3m to £7m — a jump she barely remembers experiencing. Her conclusion is that making money turned out to be the easy part; running the business and managing people is the hard part. She has never taken large sums out, reinvesting to fund hiring, offices and the New York expansion.

We made 1.5 in our first year.

Carrie Rose · 1:34:00

But I didn't really understand the concept of how easy it was to make money.

Carrie Rose · 1:34:00

Explainer· 2

Explainer55:00

Why brand matters: the Mac vs Windows laptop in Starbucks

Carrie's argument against treating brand as fluffy and unmeasurable is an observation test. Picture two people working in Starbucks, one on a Windows laptop and one on a Mac. Asked what each is working on, most people say the Mac user is making a film, an app or music — and the Windows user a spreadsheet. Nothing about the people has changed; the brand assigned them an identity. That's why people buy MacBooks, Gucci or Chanel: they're purchasing the words they want associated with themselves.

So when you buy a MacBook it's cuz you want to be seen as a creative.

Carrie Rose · 55:30
Explainer1:29:30

What her coach sees in male vs female leaders

Carrie relays a pattern from her leadership coach Nicole, who has coached over 100 CEOs and business owners at roughly a 50/50 gender split. Women leaders typically come with confidence problems — imposter syndrome, not feeling they deserve a seat at the table, constantly proving themselves. Men more often struggle to build relationships with their business, their people and their proposition, treating it as a commercial transaction. Carrie recognised herself in the first description and her now-departed co-founder in the second, and admits she sometimes envies the detachment.

Women are often struggle with their confidence in feeling like they deserve a place at the table.

Carrie Rose · 1:30:00

Men, they really struggle building relationships with their business, with their people, with their propositions.

Carrie Rose · 1:30:30

Story· 6

Story31:30

The cold call to The Sun that sold out GHD straighteners

In her first agency job at Sticky Eyes, Carrie was handed GHD PR with no training beyond 'write press releases and call journalists'. Her first call, to Vogue, ended with a hang-up. She kept dialling and reached Ellie, beauty editor at The Sun, who happened to moonlight as a hairdresser and was doing Ellie Goulding's hair that weekend. If the copper gold straighteners arrived by the next morning, she'd use them and write it up. The piece ran, GHD sold out, and more coverage followed — Carrie's first lesson in both PR mechanics and resilience.

I remember the moment that I first rang a journalist and it was um one of the first journalists that I rang was someone at…

Carrie Rose · 31:30

if you can get me in by tomorrow morning, I'll use the straighteners and I'll write a piece in The Sun about it

Carrie Rose · 32:30
Story1:02:00

The Apprentice audition that funded a business she never joined the show for

Nudged by a colleague to apply for TV, Carrie applied to The Apprentice after a few glasses of wine and was called to London within days, with two days to write a business plan. At the audition, 20 candidates were lined up with numbers on the floor and given seconds each to argue why they should go through the single door. She misread her number as a nine, went red — then stepped forward under pressure and won the slot on personality rather than credentials. She reached the final round, was told to seek private investment instead, and someone following the process offered her the money that launched Rise at Seven.

if I'm in that room, I need to stand out personality-wise

Carrie Rose · 1:03:30

I haven't gotten the show, but they've told me to go get private investment.

Carrie Rose · 1:04:30
Story1:11:30

Launching a rival agency from a competitor's own conference stage

Carrie and her co-founder Stephen were still booked to speak at SearchLeeds — the conference owned by the agency they'd just left — because the CEO judged a two-person startup harmless. Stephen opened the event, normally a welcome to the host's conference, with the Rise at Seven logo instead. Carrie was in the audience, petrified. The stunt cost some friendships but gained thousands of Twitter followers overnight in front of a few-thousand-person room, and signalled to a market with no clear leader that a disruptor had arrived.

he opened it with a Rise at Seven logo

Carrie Rose · 1:12:00

You know, purple cow. You got to stand out. You got to take risks sometimes.

Carrie Rose · 1:13:00
Story1:15:30

Winning Missguided as a two-person agency with borrowed 'staff'

A 40-minute conference talk put Carrie in front of Missguided's head of digital, who invited her to pitch as a wild card against an already-chosen agency. With only herself and her co-founder, she asked friends including Will to attend and pose as her team — then opened the pitch by admitting they didn't work for her, promising to hire them the next day if she won. The deck was simply 'if we were running Missguided's marketing strategy, this is what we would do'. They won the global account on the spot, triggering a call from Pretty Little Thing offering double, which she declined out of loyalty, and roughly 65 inbound brands.

I need you to come to a meeting with me on Monday and pretend to be my staff.

Carrie Rose · 1:16:00

but if you if we win this account, I'll hire them tomorrow

Carrie Rose · 1:16:00
Story46:30

Made redundant at three months, then tweeting her way into the next job

Carrie was made redundant from her first agency after three months, not for performance but because the agency lost a client — her first lesson that headcount cuts follow revenue and aren't personal. Under pressure with £850 monthly rent against an £850 monthly salary, she skipped the careers page entirely and tweeted the director of Branded3, who had posted the job ad, saying she wanted it. She was invited in, met the director and CEO, and was offered the role that week — a job she stayed in for around seven years.

they lose revenue, they have to cut heads. And I was like okay, so I learned not to take it personal.

Carrie Rose · 46:30

I think when I'm under pressure, I do things out of the ordinary.

Carrie Rose · 47:00
Story12:30

The road of grief: potholes that get shallower over time

After her dad died suddenly of a heart attack when she was 15, Carrie received free school-arranged counselling, available to under-16s who have lost a parent. The counsellor drew grief as a long road covered in potholes — early ones deep enough that you fall in and don't come out for weeks or months, but further along they get shallower and less frequent. It isn't moving on; it just stops tripping you up as much. Her second tip is to keep communicating: she used to text her dad's old mobile number even though the messages bounced back.

these potholes get shorter and shorter, and they get less

Carrie Rose · 13:30

And the second thing is, this might sound silly, but write letters. Like, communicate.

Carrie Rose · 13:30

Takeaway· 4

Takeaway1:26:00

The two reasons people get let go for performance

Asked what underperformers have in common, Carrie names two behaviours. The first is not speaking up — people conceal that they're struggling until it's too late, when often the gap was a training failure the company could have fixed. Both sides end up wishing something had been said. The second is failing to keep trying: campaigns don't work, results miss, and people give up rather than reviewing what they learned and applying it to the next one.

people haven't when they haven't performed well, they haven't spoken up

Carrie Rose · 1:26:00

another thing I would say is failing to keep trying

Carrie Rose · 1:26:30
Takeaway1:38:30

Your salary is about which client you serve, not how hard you work

Carrie's nurse friend earns around £32k while being ground down by NHS hours — the same hours that, in tech, could pay £200k. Ali frames it as a difference in who you sell to: people earning £40m sell to Google, Facebook and Microsoft; people earning £40k sell the same effort to far smaller businesses. Carrie balances the point by noting that £30-40k is above the UK average and that the hustle content showing 18-year-olds making £200k is not normal, just more visible than it used to be.

You do realize if you work those hours in just in the tech industry, you could be doing 200 grand a year.

Carrie Rose · 1:39:00

If you're earning 30, 40 grand, you're earning more than average in the UK wage.

Carrie Rose · 1:39:30
Takeaway19:30

How she starts conversations with strangers: find the shared hook

Asked to make her natural sociability teachable, Carrie describes scanning for something she can identify with. On a train she noticed a woman browsing the New Look site and writing marketing notes, asked whether she worked there, and connected via a mutual contact in their marketing team. The method is to spot the overlap between you and them, or a way to add value to their day — and, mechanically, to look up from your phone in the first place. She cites an Uber driver who turned out to be a videographer and is now a LinkedIn connection.

You just got to be able to have the confidence to talk to people and be open-minded and welcoming

Carrie Rose · 19:30

I usually see something that I can identify with.

Carrie Rose · 21:00
Takeaway1:44:00

Her definition of success: freedom from other people's opinions and her own mind

Carrie separates the company's mission from her personal one. Success for her is freedom from other people's opinions and from her own mind — and she says she isn't there yet, still telling herself ideas aren't good enough despite what she's built. She expects to reach it through continuing to learn about herself, people and business, perhaps by 40 or 50. Alongside that sits a stated purpose: because confidence is what let her tweet for a job, go to uni and do marketing differently, she wants to give other people the confidence to do things differently too.

Success for me is freedom of other people's opinions

Carrie Rose · 1:44:00

my job and my purpose here is to give other people that confidence to do things differently

Carrie Rose · 1:45:30